Sports – Barry Bonds hit No. 756 over the right-center field wall Tuesday night, and hammered home the point: Like him or not, legitimate or not, he is baseball's new home run king.
If you think the Barry Bonds controversy is a race issue, you're dead wrong. Everyone recognizes Hank Aaron as a great baseball player and knows he deserves the record.
The issue here is whether a player who has obviously used steroids should be considered in the same league as someone who hasn't.
Black people can be controversial, just like white people (Mark Maguire). So stop trying to play the race card for something that isn't even related to it.
Also, I love how certain people call others "idiots" when their responses are littered with erroneous grammar and spelling.
So explain why Lance Armstrong is so celebrated and Bonds isn't?
that really is a tough one.. everyone pulled for him because of his cancer.. and he was in a sport not typically American...
he not only denies he used them.. he sues anyone who suggests otherwise...
In a poll done by ESPN asking white fans and black fans whether or not they want Bonds to break the the HR record, 74% of black fans said they do while 28% white fans didn't want him to break it.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=286...
To say race isn't an issue is incorrect.
i didn't want him to break it but it had nothing to do with his race..
i don't like a-holes of any color...
I hear you. I'm no Bonds fan. Don't get me wrong. But it is an interesting question.....
yep.. on any given day I'm sometimes for Pete Rose making the hall.. then other days.. I think why honor cheaters...
there is the question...
do you think Bonds is a first ballot hall of fame inductee.. or will he have to wait a while like Michael Irvin did... ??
I think Pete Rose paid the price and he should be let in. We are a forgiving society. People get forgiven all the time. Some people in sports gets multiple chances. He should get his due.
Bonds is no doubt a first ballot hall of famer. Even without steroids, his numbers prior to the dates he supposedly started taking them were Hall of Fame-ish. If you look at it like this, during the baseball steroid era, Bonds is the only one breaking the record. Nobody else. It doesn't diminish the fact that the guy, like him or not, is a great baseball player. One of the best ever.
I agree... just not sure how the baseball writers who vote are going to feel.. then there's that pesky grand jury investigation... If he gets convicted of perjury.. it would be very hard to attend the induction from prison...
by the way our local paper had an article on Pete today.. about his foul language when addressing a little league camp... several parents removed their children during his 1 hour rambling.. and many said he sounded intoxicated...
Armstrong has been tested more than any other athlete for use of drugs and never ever has a positive test result obtained.
Unfortunately for Bonds baseball does not test in the same manner. Armstrong won nearly 100 stages of the Tour De France and each stage winner is tested. In addition there are random tests during the race of many riders and tests at non competative times. Armstrong passed every test and you can see his body is not different than others as you find with people like Bonds.
Anyone who can pass that many tests is clean and that is what Armstrong is the most proven clean for drugs athlete in history. That is why he is celebrated and Bonds isn't since Bonds has only his say so to prove him clean.
As steroids become more sophisticated and harder to detect, it's likely that someone will break Bonds' record in the next 25 years.
A-rod will break it in 8 years.
wonder if Barry will show up to congratulate A-rod.
I think he would....we'll see. I do believe A-Rod, barring injury, will hit in the mid-800's.
i agree.. to bad Junior.. missed all those games with injury and played on a team that sucks...
IMHO.. the sweetest swing in baseball, maybe of all time.. he's picture perfect..
Just because a greater percentage of whites don't want him to break the record doesn't mean that they don't want him to break it because he's black. I'd be willing to bet you that more black people want to see him break it because he is a black man breaking another record and I can't say I don't blame them, because Barry Bonds breaking this record marks another milestone for blacks, especially in a predominantly white sport.
If anything, Barry Bonds being black has created a more postive influx from the black community rather than a negative one from the white community. Also, polls tend to get a lot more negative responses than positives, that's a fact of polling.
That doesn't make any sense. 74% of blacks polled wanted him to break it, 28% didn't. Explain the disparity then if it isn't racial?
So are you trying to tell me if Mark McGuire was breaking the record, those poll numbers would be the same? Or would more whites want him to break the record because a white man was breaking it?
Be consistent.
Race is not an issue here, steroids use is. People are no more critical of Barry Bonds than they were of Mark Maguire. During the latter home run race, the majority of people were rooting for Sammy Sosa, because he was less suspect to steroid use. Not only that, but since Mark Maguire's Congressional hearing, he has been shunned by the entire Cardinals organization, including fans.
Again I ask the question, why is Lance Armstrong celebrated and Bonds isn't if the main critical aspect is steroids?
and again I answer - Armstrong has been tested for drugs and steroids more than any athlete in history. All those tests were negative and thus he is clean of steroid use. Bonds on the other hand is the most suspect of all current athletes of using steroids.
What Armstrong has as shown by medical tests is lungs and lung capacity larger than normal for his size. Endurance sports like bike racing require more and/or better use by the body of oxygen. Though different than normal all medical reports indicate that increased ability and size in Armstrong is natural and not drug enduced.
It's history*, But it's tainted. I think that dopers are the scum of the earth. Barry Bonds may have 756*, but in my book, Hank Aaron is still the home run king. I'm just waiting for A-Rod to beat Bonds mark so Barry is no longer at the top with his 756* home runs. If we really want to stop doping it needs to be a lifetime ban for the first positive test of any banned substance.
Here are some things to consider:
1. Shoeless Joe Jackson was not only a better ballplayer than Bonds, he was a better human being. The fact that he turned in the money he was offered proved that [And when the White Sox finally won the World Series a couple years back, Jackson was finally able to come home and rest. Not that the 'Field of Dreams' was not a home, if you understand the meaning of the movie].
2. Aaron and Marris competed and made their records the right way. 715 and 61 were done the old fashioned way...with hard work.
3. Here is a partial list of pitchers of the past modern era [60's and 70's] that Bonds could not hit even if he had a corked bat: Don Drysdale, Bob Gibson, Sandy Koufax, Tom Seaver, Al Downing, Whitey Ford, Dean Chance, Mickey Lolich, Jim Lonborg, Al Jackson, Jim Kaat, Steve Carlton, Jim Palmer, Jim 'Mudcat' Grant, Catfish Hunter, Nolan Ryan, Jim McAndrew, Tug McGraw, Ron Guidry, Don Cardwell, Wade Blasingame, J. R. Richard and a ton of others.
I already explained the disparity. More black people want him to win because he is black, not white people want him to lose because he is black. He has more support from the black community because he is a black making big strides in a sport that is mostly white.
There is nothing inconsistent about my statements. If Mark Maguire were breaking the record, there would be minimal support from both sides. If you haven't figured it out, due to racial segregation and other bars put on blacks throughout time in a sport as old as baseball, the record books and hall of fame are predominatly whites. The black community, as it should, openly supports its members making important and historical marks, like Barry Bonds breaking this record. Being in the black community is something that is celebrated amongst them and I think their unity is reflected somewhat in that poll.
Just because a statistic appears to be explained one way doesn't make it true. There are a plethora of different factors that go into polling and its results. I'm not saying that some of the white population doesn't like Barry Bonds because he is black, but most of them don't want to see him break the record because they view what he did as cheating and they don't want to see the record books of the game they love tarnished by someone they consider a cheater.
Maybe if you actually look at the world critically and don't jump to the first conclusion that pops in your head, you could understand there could be underlying factors that affect data.
Statistics are a little bit more complex than, "oooo ooo numbers!"
Baseball is a farce and so is Barry Bonds, I would have never known he broke the record until I logged onto Netscape. Baseball is not, I REPEAT IS NOT AMERICA"S FAVORITE PAST time in relation to sports. I only wish you stupid fans would realize you created these a holes by continuing to support them, I gave up baseball after the last strike, and I have never watched another game. Barry Bonds your out!!! Oh one another thing, Why does Mark McGuire look so old now? hmmmm something tells me his body is getting back at him for all those chemicals he ingested. GO TO HELL BASEBALL!!!
In case you didn't know this, Mark Maguire did break a record for most home runs in a season. He had enormous support from everyone until his Congressional hearing where he "refused to talk about the past." After that, his fan club dispersed and he lost practically all his support from both black and whites. Believe it or not, most people see players for how they play and conduct themselves, not for the color of their skin.
I also love how people are claiming they know whether Bonds could hit off pitchers from past decades. You don't know that anymore than how to analyze a poll. And with regards to your comment, "So you're saying Bonds didn't work hard?"
If someone studies hard for a test enough to get an 85, but they want an "A", so they cheat off the guy next to them to get a 94%, they're still a cheater and any teacher would give them a 0 regardless of how har they worked.
Please do your best to comprehend this analogy.
Don't talk down to me. Try making your arguement without sounding like a pompous a-hole.
When Mark McGwire broke the record, he was celebrated as a hero. When Barry Bonds broke it? People like you are apathetic to it.
Hmmm....maybe thats because steroids are much more of an issue today than when McGwire broke the record? There was no Jose Canseco, no congressional hearings, no mass media coverage on HGH and other steroids.
If McGwire had broken that record today he would have seen the same disaproval as Bonds.
I can't agree with that. Everyone knew McGwire was on roids back then. Just like everyone "knows" Bonds took it. Even with everyone "knowing" he was on something didn't change public opinion. Jose's book and Congress holding hearings because of it doesn't change the fact that the circumstances were the for both players.
It's all good man. I don't consider myself better than you in any way (except I'm a little better than you in stats) because I don't even know you. I apologize if I came across as being pompous, and, re-reading my posts has made me realize where you are coming from in that regard. I came on here to justify my point in a civilized manner, and I'm sorry if I strayed from my objective. It's just some previous people have made some rather unruly comments and I apologize that the past has affected my dispute with you. I recognize that racism is still a serious problem in this country, but don't be so quick to label things as such, because often times you will get the boy-who-cried-wolf effect. Thank you for staying civil, even though I hadn't completely.
It's cool man.
I'm a baseball guy. I'm definately a stat guy. I think I can challenge you in a good old fashioned baseball trivia game and give you a run for the money. :-)
Again....i'm not a Bonds fan but I think he's still a HOF player and deserves credit. Much of the hatred for him comes from the fact that he's an a-hole. The fact that he's black exasperates the hatred more than it would anyone else.
I may be wrong but I don't think so.
Either way I like talking baseball. A nice change of pace.....plus I like a good debate.
Where is the proof of substance abuse? Where are the test results? Not one of you can produce any credible facts that Barry has used,or ever did use.All the test's proved negative.Just because another player who was caught using,says others are using,isnt proof.I hope for your sake your not judged the way you judge.But then again you might liven up the dungeon called HELL! Santa you remind me of the whinners you spoke of.CONGRATULATIONS BARRY ON YOUR NEW RECORD,(THE HOME RUN KING!) DIRTYBULL
Yessir Dirtybull! A couple of hacks with an axe to grind put a lot of BS into a book and all of a sudden everyone "knows" that Bonds does/did steroids. No proof, just speculation. "His head has grown!" they'll yell, but medically that's rather silly. Lots of people lose their youthful sleekness for a beefed up look quite naturally. I am one of them. Look at Magic Johnson. How many of you posters in your 40's and fifties still weigh and look the same as you did in your twenties?
Until there is PROOF, he should be considered innocent. That is the American way, that is the fair way. Besides that, there is no known chemical, NONE, NADA, that can give a person the amazing hand eye coordination required to put that little cylinder of wood flush on the sweet spot of a 95 MPH fastball.
CONGRATULATIONS BARRY!!!
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756 All right. I'm not a big bonds fan ( I like #55 Tim Lincecum , #13 Omar Vizquel & #14 Fred Lewis )